Steve Spilde: Today. I am honored to welcome my friend and mentor, Vince Hatt. Vince was a
longtime director of the Franciscan Spirituality Center, and he happens to be one of the wisest
people I know. Welcome, Vince.
Vince Hatt: Thank you very much. [It’s] good to be here.
Steve: Vince, you were on the podcast a couple years ago, and since then you spent some time
in the
...See More hospital, correct?
Vince: Correct, yes.
Steve: You were diagnosed with a form of cancer?
Vince: Yeah, Acute Myeloid Leukemia.
Steve: Have you been feeling OK?
Vince: Yeah, most of the time.
Steve: As you face the challenge of cancer, Vince, how has spirituality changed for you? What
seems more important? What seems less important in your life?
Vince: Well, let me start with a story. In 1967 – 55 years ago – I was a young priest [at] Holy
Ghost of Dubuque, and I was visiting Eleanor in the hospital. Eleanor had breast cancer. It was
Stage 4, and finally they knew they could do no more for her. I came in there very worried when
I got that information. She looked at me and said, “Vince, either way I’ll be OK.” I was to lead
a tour to Europe for 17 days, and she was not supposed to be able to survive that long. I said
goodbye to her tearfully and thanked her for who she was in my life, and I went off to Europe. I
got back 17 days later at 2 a.m., and I went immediately to the rectory office, looked into the
book of deaths in the parish, and she was not in there. I got up at 6 a.m., went to the hospital and
said, “Eleanor, I can see you again.” She said, “Thank God you’re back. You can have my
funeral,” and she died two days later. She prepared me for this moment: either way, I’ll be OK.
I’ve kind of prayed into that over the years knowing that someday I’m going to get a death
sentence. My response was actually, “Either way, I’ll be OK.” I had also heard that Francis
once said, “What if you find out you’re going to die tomorrow?” He said, “I’d continue to hoe
the garden.” I’ve continued to hoe the garden. I still do Spiritual Direction. I still do groups. I
still write articles. So really, my life hasn’t changed significantly except every six weeks I go in
for IV chemo. The things that were important are still important, which is relationships and my
desire to love God and neighbor, so it wasn’t really drastic.
Now, I’m no hero. I hate pain. I’m not afraid so much of death, but pain? I’m afraid of that.
But on the other hand, I’ve had severe depression for three years, and this is trivial compared to
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that. Depression is 24/7, and it’s everywhere. It’s omnipresent. This [cancer] is … I go in every
six weeks, otherwise my life is pretty much the same. That’s kind of my story right now.
Steve: How many years ago did you have the depression?
Vince: The worst depression was from 1986 to 1989. I’ve had bouts afterwards, but that really
was the one that was God-awful.
Steve: What did you learn from that journey that’s been helpful since you’ve had cancer?
Vince: Probably acceptance. There is so little that I can control. You just have to show up each
day and see what the day presents. I was a compulsive driver …
Steve: Do you mean, like, pushing yourself all the time?
Vince: I’m a ___________. If something wasn’t successful, I just worked harder. Now, I’m at a
stage where I’m riding a horse and notice it’s dead, I get off of it. I don’t push like I used to.
Steve: How did that work for you, riding a dead horse in the old days?
Vince: It didn’t work very well. It just didn’t work – it exhausted me.
Steve: That’s why I said you’re one of the wisest people I know – when the horse is dead, you
get off, which isn’t a universal response.
Vince: No. And sometimes I’m on a little too long. _______ start smelling, and I get off.
Steve: When you’ve been challenged in the last couple years and throughout your life, what are
your sources of resilience?
Vince: That’s a good question. I suppose my parents. My parents went through hard stuff, but
they never gave up. My mother was depressed all my life, and she never gave up – she always
hung in there. A source of resilience is my Christian faith. If you want to live, you’ve got to die,
and the dying you’ve got to do is to one’s own ego. That’s been a never-ending challenge. I’m
much better at it now than I was when I was young.
Vincent Hatt, Thank you for your messages of "Either Way, I'll Be Okay;" Terminal Diagnosis Is Trivial Compared To Severe Depression; Acceptance; Getting Off A Dead Horse; Never Giving Up (Resilience); "If You Want To Live, You Gotta Die, and The Dying You Gotta Do Is To One's Own Ego;" If You Accept Your Death, You Can Live Without Fear; Not Fearing Death, but Curious; "Jesus Is Risen, We Win, Let's Party;" Not Being Optimistic, but Hopeful; Divine Milieu and Transcendence (Fish In The Ocean Metaphor); Everything Belongs (Mistakes and Wasted Years Versus The Valuable Lessons Learned); Being OK Just As You Are and Not Having To Measure Up To Anything…God Loves You Just As You Are; Heaven's Perfect Baseball Game; Feeling Different or Special Versus Oneness of Conscience; Death Happens To All of Us and Was Long In Play Before The Terminal Diagnosis; Wholeness; True Self; Love Wins; The "12-Step" Bottom and Perhaps A Future Collective Bottom For Humanity; and "Not Because I Am Unique…If I'm Honest…(People Will) Maybe Be Able To Put Words To Their Own Story (Of Sacredness, Holiness, Fullness, and The Divine Other).
Thank you for your Priesthood, Spiritual Direction, Friendship, Wisdom, LaCrosse Tribune articles, Podcasts, Book (5 Minutes Matter: End of Life Reflections on Spirituality and Religion), Honesty, Candidness; Humility; and others.
Vincent Hatt, I love you. Thank you for making a difference. You will continue to make a difference in my life and many others' throughout our lifetimes. Even your passing can't take that away from us. --Bryan Ewing.
