In 2004, reality TV was in, but it was decidedly out in the fashion industry, which was not impressed with competitions riddled with bug-eating and bad behavior. Then Project Runway arrived. The Heidi Klum-hosted show was a series that showcased true talent and ambition, launching the careers of designers like Austin Scarlett and Christian Siriano, and was the first to make reality TV safe for A-listers, who knocked down its doors in troves to appear as guest judges. But the road to success wasn’t always as clear for the now-iconic series. In this episode, co-hosts Allison Piwowarski and Kate Ward research the uphill battle Project Runway had to be embraced in the industry, including the series’ difficulty casting its judges in an elitist world. Plus, we delve into that corn husk dress, where the season 1 contestants are now, and the warm hug of a human that is Tim Gunn.

Sources: The Hollywood Reporter, Time Magazine, The Washington Post, PopSugar