folks, we're always thinking about falling civilizations, aren't we? whether it's the old civilizations that fell long ago or fretting over when our current empires will fall, it's often on our minds. and that's why we brought on Dr. Paul M.M. Cooper, host of the Fall of Civilizations podcast and the author of the recently-released book, Fall of Civilizations: Stories of Greatness and Decline. we talk with Paul about why ruins are so fascinating, what we can learn from the fall civs of the past, what misconceptions people have about them, and what they mean for the future falls of our own civilizations. it's great, check it out!